SMUD MOSAC Inspires Discovery In Science, STEM and Sustainability for All Ages.

Andrea Durham: [00:00:00] We get a lot of feedback from parents that their child felt successful for the first time in their lives. And these are kids who might be 12 years old. And to think that they're feeling successful for the first time ever because they got to do something on their own terms and in their own way. By that age, they're making choices about what courses they're going to take in school.

That kid might have been on track to drop out. You know, I don't want to take advanced science or math or something classes. I'm not going to be an engineer. I'm not smart enough. And now all of a sudden they're saying, Hey, wait a minute. I can do this. The world is my oyster. I can take more classes, and they can see a future that they might not have seen before.

It's pretty special.

Jeff Holden: Hi, I'm Jeff Holden. Welcome to the Nonprofit Podcast Network. Our purpose and passion is to highlight a nonprofit [00:01:00] organization in each weekly episode, giving that organization an opportunity to tell their story. In their words, to better inform and educate the respective communities they serve, as well as provide one more tool for them to share their message to constituents and donors.

Our goal is to help build stronger communities through shared voices, and to both encourage and support the growth of local non profit organizations. through podcasting thanks to our founding partners for their foresight and helping us transform the way conversations start cap trust fiduciary advice for endowments and foundations runyan saltzman incorporated rse marketing advertising and public relations creating integrated communications committed to improving lives and western health advantage a full service health care plan for individuals employer groups and families sacramento is home to many great museums And we're fortunate for that, but this discussion is going to [00:02:00] be about what I would suggest is the most visible museum in town, in the region even.

It's one many of us have seen and may have even questioned what it was because its name is actually an acronym, MOZAK. We know it as that iconic building just as you enter downtown on Interstate 5. But what is it, this oddly organized, gray domed, and red boxed assembly of shapes? MOZAK, Museum of Science and Curiosity.

What a great name. And another iconic business is a part of that name as the primary organization responsible for the museum. Of course, it's another acronym most of us know. SMUD, or the Sacramento Metropolitan Utility District. Two acronyms, two community icons, one unbelievable result. My bias for the museum is evident in the episode, so we'll let that speak for itself.

But we're also fortunate to have a woman as [00:03:00] executive director who comes from a science background and has made a career in museum leadership. Interestingly enough, all the museums on her resume have science in their name. Museum of Science Boston, Science World Vancouver, St. Louis Science Center. And now she can add SMUD's Museum of Science and Curiosity To her curricula vitae, Andrea Durham, welcome to the nonprofit podcast network.

Andrea Durham: Thank you for having me. 

Jeff Holden: I'm so happy to have you here because the experience of what you represent at the museum and that is the museum. of Science and Curiosity, Mosaic, and we'll get into that in just a second, is so much more than what people might expect of a museum. And I've had the benefit of being there now a couple of times and the experience is what is unique because it's a tactile, it's an audio, it's a complete [00:04:00] sensory engagement experience when you're at the museum with so many of the exhibits.

You just, you just can't help but dive in. That's 

Andrea Durham: the 

Jeff Holden: idea. Tell us a little bit. about how it all came together, how the museum actually evolved. And now we have this wonderful place for Sacramentans to visit and engage and experience. 

Andrea Durham: Well, the organization has existed for a long time, something in the neighborhood of 70 years.

There was a small museum called the Discovery Center. 

Jeff Holden: I remember the museum. I didn't realize they were the Outgrowth of each other. 

Andrea Durham: Exactly. And the board of directors had a really visionary imagination that we should have, that Sacramento, a city like Sacramento, deserves a proper science center of the scale of our city.

And to serve our city. And so they launched this big vision. [00:05:00] of creating a bigger science center that could serve more people. And that vision, along with the broken down PG& E historic building, came together. Make a very long story short, MOSAC came to be, that building was restored and then an addition was put on.

to give us a state of the art planetarium and lobby and various amenities. And so MOSAC came to be through the hard work of many, many, many committed Sacramentans. And it's so exciting that we were able to do that. 

Jeff Holden: And I know that's, it was like a 12, 15 year process to make this all happen for so many reasons because of environmental and the building itself and the earthquake retrofits and then new facility and then of course the capital funding to make it all work.

Andrea Durham: Exactly. It was a huge, I think it was closer to a 20 year project. And yeah, a lot of money and, and effort by a lot of people went into that. It 

Jeff Holden: is [00:06:00] amazing the success of what they built from that dream. And that's, we'll get there a little bit in the conversation too. When I was there the other day, As I was walking through the parking lot, busload after busload after busload.

There were five buses of Elk Grove Unified School District. Uprolls, three more buses from Roseville. I can only imagine the attendees that you get at the museum over the course of a year. Who, who is the museum really built for? 

Andrea Durham: Well, first of all, today we got busloads from Chico. 

Jeff Holden: Oh my goodness. 

Andrea Durham: Right? Can you imagine?

So they were having a blast when I left the museum to come over here. So it was built for everybody. We're really here to serve our whole community and beyond. Northern California. Really, as I just mentioned with these kids from Chico. And so [00:07:00] we have a toddler, everything from a toddler area. I mean, I see people, sometimes I can't help it and I stop somebody because they've got a teeny tiny baby.

And I say, how old is that baby? And they'll say like three weeks. And I say, well, never too young to start learning STEM. 

Jeff Holden: No. 

Andrea Durham: Usually they're there with another child that's running around. But everything from toddlers, we have a beautiful little toddler zone. Through, we get busloads of seniors coming in to just have a blast.

A fun fact is the number one reason nationally that people come to science museums or science centers, and we kind of use those words interchangeably in my world, is to have a quality experience together. So it doesn't matter how old you are. You see them coming in the front door all the time. They might be 18 year olds here on a date or a group of seniors or just a couple It's really an experience that anybody can have, and it's, it brings people, what I love is it brings [00:08:00] people closer together.

So, I talked to a family last Monday that came in, they stayed for five hours, and they kept texting me and saying, we didn't know it was for everybody, there's a group of adults right next to us engaged in building, Mars rovers for half an hour, and they're just four adults. And we're just having so much fun among all kinds of people here.

We had no idea it was for everybody. And that's the reaction most people. Which is, we didn't know! You 

Jeff Holden: didn't know. We don't expect to be so immersed in the experience of the exhibits. I think that's the neat part of it. Whether you're, you know, two or, you know, 80. Exactly, 

Andrea Durham: and sometimes my favorite thing is three generations.

When I see three generations building something together, like super concentrating together and having banter, and I also know that next week they're going to still be [00:09:00] talking about it at the dinner table. And yes, people learn things along the way, people like to come and learn, but their primary reason for coming is to have fun, there isn't anything like it, it's a unique experience, it brings them together, they get to put down their phones, they get away from the screen, and they have a quality time together, and that just warms my heart, because you don't always have great opportunities to do that anymore.

Jeff Holden: Yeah, there's really not anything of conflict, it's, it's all beneficial. And to your point of just the experience of people being together again, yes, that's. And it's all neutral. It's, did you know? Oh my gosh, that was fun. I remember that is how I went through it with all those emotions from things when you go through the space center of, Oh, I remember watching that on TV.

On, you have an old TV that was like what we watched it on, which is great. And Just [00:10:00] experiencing some of it over again is so neat, and for those of us who are of whatever age where you see something that relives that experience, it only further enhances the relationship, too, when you can really share it together with somebody else who gets what you're talking about.

Andrea Durham: Great. And making memories together. It's priceless. 

Jeff Holden: Right. Oh, there you go. That's what Mosaic is. It's priceless. Back to the attendees. There are all sorts, socio economic and education and age. It does serve a purpose beyond just the experience because we're talking about STEM. And you're teaching kids predominantly about, you know, science, technology.

Andrea Durham: Engineering and 

Jeff Holden: math. And they added an A in there, too, for STEAM, right? Sometimes 

Andrea Durham: we call it STEAM, yep, the arts, because these days, we, in the modern world we live in, we really think of those things as integrated. [00:11:00] So it's not just like, oh, we're going to hang a picture on the wall and we're going to call it STEAM.

It's more so really sophisticated curriculum now, is project based, and all those things are integrated. Really great project work happens in schools that are really great. Get kids immersed in all of those, and they can see the interconnectedness. That's the way the world lives, right? Your world is not just, oh, right now I'm thinking about biology, and then, you know, a few minutes later, now I am going to do math.

Like, that's not the way our world is, right? So, those things in the world are integrated, and in a really engaging project at school, they're integrated, and so that's where the word STEAM really comes in. 

Jeff Holden: Well, and we think about Art is engineered in so many cases. I look at it and I think this, this, whomever that artist was, had to be way beyond just that creative concept of scratching something out on a piece of paper.

I mean, go back to a Picasso. One of Picasso's big designs, like in the [00:12:00] city of Chicago. That had to be engineered. 

Andrea Durham: When you think of the science of, and technology of paint, that is thousands of years old. Yes. That is science and technology. 

Jeff Holden: Yeah. And even with the rabbit at our Sacramento airport, it didn't get up there.

It didn't get built. Somebody had to engineer this, this concept that the artist had. So the elements of what we think of as art tied into, you know, engineering and math, it's just all so integrated, as you said. 

Andrea Durham: And one of the things we take pride in is that it's very self directed learning, and people love that.

People want to have control over their own learning. 95 percent of learning happens outside of school. And so we're all about self directed, self activated learning. Take learning into your own hands and learn what you want to learn. And one of the things we love is that it really stimulates people to do more learning.

So you might see, you're talking about memories of the space program. [00:13:00] You might also go home and it might make you curious and think, Oh, there's, I have some other questions about space and travel in space. I'm going to look that up. I'm going to keep learning. And that's what we want to encourage is lifelong learning, realizing that science and digging into more learning about it is really fun.

On your own terms, 

Jeff Holden: right? And you don't have to because it's a class or whatever, 

Andrea Durham: right? Nothing against school, right? We love school and schools, but this is augmenting that, right? And, and carrying people forward in their own learning their whole lives. 

Jeff Holden: Now, something we saw at the back as we're, I believe on the second floor, there's a lab.

Andrea Durham: With 

Jeff Holden: computers on every desk, notebook computers, and it looked like maybe 3D design of some sort. Tell us a little bit about that. I mean, obviously nobody was in there at the time we were there, but clearly that is a teaching maker space of some sort. 

Andrea Durham: That's [00:14:00] exactly what it is. We call it our design lab.

Jeff Holden: Okay. 

Andrea Durham: And groups of kids get to come in. We have workshops that you can sign up for on our website that are longer experiences. So a visit to the museum might be between an hour and a half and five hours long. Those are experiences that workshops that kids can sign up for. And there are four Saturdays in a row at the moment, but we're going to do more various combinations.

But what I love about the design lab is that they're given a project. So the project might be design and build your own wind turbine. Or it might be design and build your own rocket. And they're given all the tools they need. And we have facilitators that give them guidance, but they're doing their own project based, self directed learning.

They're taking it in their own direction. So we give them a real, a computer with a real CAD program. There are soldering irons that they learn how to use safely. We have laser cutters. We have 3D printers. All these resources available to them. [00:15:00] And they design their rocket. They get to go outside and shoot it off and see how it does.

And then they can come back inside and redesign their rocket. And what I really love is that we're really changing kids lives. We get a lot of feedback from parents that their child felt successful for the first time in their lives. And these are kids who might be 12 years old. And to think that they're feeling successful for the first time ever, cause they got to do something on their own terms and in their own way.

And that just, I mean, sometimes I tell stories about kids in that space and people's tears, eyes tear up. I mean, it's, it's really making a difference. And it makes kids, by that age, they're making choices about what courses they're going to take in school. That kid might have I've been on track to drop out.

You know, I don't want to take advanced science or math or something classes. I'm not going to be an engineer. I'm not smart enough. All right, you know, and now all of a sudden they're saying, Hey, wait a minute. [00:16:00] I can do this. The world is my oyster. I can take more classes. Like, and they can see a future that they might not have seen before.

It's pretty special. 

Jeff Holden: Well, I can certainly appreciate that too, because you've got the diversity of opportunity in there from, from biological to mechanical to electronic, whatever. Maybe they were overwhelmed at just the thought of all of it. And all of a sudden they find one that they really enjoyed and had.

Yeah. Had a great time. Then it's a whole different experience. Ah, then I can do this. Yeah. I like that. And I was good at it. And somebody said I was good at it. So that reinforcement that can come from just that experience is amazing. 

Andrea Durham: Absolutely. And our team is so great at facilitating just the right way, that the kids really own it.

They give just as much help as the kid asks for. It's, our team is amazing and really makes it all happen. 

Jeff Holden: Yeah. That really embraces the interest. In the right way. 

Andrea Durham: Yep. 

Jeff Holden: And then they [00:17:00] take that back and it comes back, as you said, to the dinner table, to the school, to the classroom, to the friends, you know, whatever it may be.

Andrea Durham: Yeah. 

Jeff Holden: There are so many exhibits and I love almost all of them. Are there a few that you can highlight? Let's see if they're the same as the ones I really like. That you would say are the significant, these are really unique and they really engage a lot of people that you see more often or hear more often about.

Andrea Durham: It's a little like asking me who my favorite kid is. I know. 

Jeff Holden: That's, then you tell me about the ones that are already gone. Oh, but it's already gone. 

Andrea Durham: You know, I would say, so yeah, we have some real crowd pleasers. And I would say one of them is we have a water exhibit. So the philosophy of MoSAC was that we would create spaces that highlighted the huge challenges of our world.

That we are facing some wicked challenges in this world, but we don't want to depress [00:18:00] people, we want to get people involved in making the world a better place. So we want to present those challenges, but we present them in a local, place based lens. So our water exhibit's a great example of that. You know, you can very easily imagine, yes, water is a global problem.

California has very specific water challenges. So we have this great water exhibit, but you know, we're our business is to give people hope and get people engaged in the topic, not to depress them about the problems in the world. So that's a long way of saying we have this wonderful salmon exhibit where you get to pretend you're a salmon.

And you get to swim upstream. You're already laughing. I can tell you did this. I did it. I 

Jeff Holden: did. Can't wait to share. 

Andrea Durham: And so you get to swim like a child, a salmon and you swim upstream and you have to not get eaten by a bear or not get eaten by, or not get. Picked off by a fisherman, or things like that, and it's, it's kinesthetic, [00:19:00] it uses your whole body, it's, you gotta do it to, you know, you've gotta experience it, describe me in audio, with audio it's not the 

Jeff Holden: same.

It's difficult, right? 

Andrea Durham: But anyway, so, Pretend You're a Salmon is really, really fun. We have a kinesthetic sand exhibit, where you get to sculpt your own mountains, and build a dam, and make it rain, and make it snow, and That is such a crowd pleaser that we have to refill the sand. At least once a week. 

Jeff Holden: They take it with?

Andrea Durham: Well, the sand just kind of makes its way out of the sand exhibit into hands and pockets and who knows. We also have some more sophisticated exhibits that help you understand the history of these water challenges. It's called projection mapping and it's kind of cool and dramatic. So that's, that's all in our water exhibit, but we have so many.

We have stories, I love the stories from around the world where Kids from all over the planet recorded stories [00:20:00] with their cell phones during COVID because that's when we were building the museum was during COVID. And so we have like absolutely mind boggling stories about kids as young as 10. Making a huge difference in their community, helping to save the planet, basically, themselves.

And so those are, those really I love. Because they're telling it with their own voice. Also, Kiva blocks, Kiva planks are like my all time, hands down, open ended. Like the epitome of open ended experiences. Like in it to the way Lego originally was right. You know, originally Lego is bricks and your imagination.

Jeff Holden: Yep, 

Andrea Durham: and that's what Kiva planks are. They're just a million beautifully tactile maple planks and we see people building phenomenal. I've seen families Worked together for two hours building this [00:21:00] magnificent Akiva sculpture. 

Jeff Holden: Only to be taken down as soon as they walk 

Andrea Durham: away. Well, either they think it's going to stay forever or the kids get a huge pleasure out of knocking it down and going home.

Jeff Holden: See Mama and Dad? 

Andrea Durham: Either way is fine with us. 

Jeff Holden: We did the salmon. Swim like a salmon. Did 

Andrea Durham: you survive? 

Jeff Holden: My producer and I did it. 

Andrea Durham: Did you survive? 

Jeff Holden: I survived. My producer got eaten by an otter, was it? 

Andrea Durham: Yeah, some people just want to see what it's like to get eaten. That's okay too. 

Jeff Holden: So neat to just move around, and we do have this on a YouTube channel, so we'll put that visual up there.

It's just how you move your body, which helps you traverse the waterway, which is gently turning and moving, and blockage, and animals, and all sorts of things, the shallow water. You move forward to go faster, you move backwards to slow yourself down. [00:22:00] And of course, as you're doing it, I see The first time doing it.

Okay, now I got it. Alright, now we're gonna Challenge each other. I'm going to do mine, you do yours, and we'll see who goes faster. And I can see that just going and progressing. It was so, so neat to just watch. But you're also learning, oh, well, that's not good for a salmon. Or that animal eats salmon, so you don't want to get in that space.

And what a neat experience for anybody who really has no idea, but also for everybody. Who wants to see how the kinesthetic part of it works. It's just a neat piece of technology 

Andrea Durham: now I can't I also can't leave out our planetarium. I mean that's near and dear to my heart. We have a state of the art Planetarium and what's special about mosaic is that I already mentioned our amazing team We only do live shows for planetarium shows in there And so the [00:23:00] team members are trained in, I don't know how they memorize all these astronomy facts, and they help you explore our solar system, learn about our planets close to us, or you can go to mind boggling places in the universe and You really have to see a planetarium show.

It's, again, describing it is, is lame, but our team, we don't have any like pre recorded, pre filmed anything. It's all live, taking you on a tour through the universe or through the planets and our team, they answer questions and they just bring it to life for people. And it's, it's really special. 

Jeff Holden: Whoever was responsible.

for the showing that was coming up when we were there was kind enough to change the scene when we walked in From what it was. He said this is better and get this when we were shooting some video of it [00:24:00] And the people who were in the seats for the next exhibit next showing they were talking about I had no idea what they were talking about, but the constellations and oh, there's that and there's this and Oh my gosh, I have no clue what they're talking about other than like the Big Dipper.

And they were pointing out multiple different constellations. So it was really neat that they were aware, but more so just what a beautiful. And how serene. Yeah. I could imagine just, put that up there, let me take a break, I'm going to lay on the floor and just stare for 15 minutes to, you know, decompress.

Andrea Durham: Yeah, I should remember that next time I'm struggling with something. We haven't done that yet. 

Jeff Holden: I can't imagine. And, to your point on the thing that you were talking about with sand, the technology that went into that exhibit, that one is so hard to explain. What you see, you hold these wands [00:25:00] over the landscape, which is our valley, and it creates Makes 

Andrea Durham: it rain.

Jeff Holden: Rain or snow, and if you have too much of it, it floods, your dam breaks. And this is all virtual, but 

Andrea Durham: Except the sand is real. 

Jeff Holden: But created by You with some of the elements. If you say, well, I need to protect that part of the valley. I can do that. I'll put up a dam here. And then when you do the water fills up in the back.

And, and this is all virtual, but in three dimensions. It's so hard to explain. That's why the technology of it come see it. Come do it. You must see it. You must do it. You must see it. All right, we can go on. Or ever on the exhibits. True. I just so enjoyed myself with that. And when we had our kids, our grandkids there, and kids, we had, we were the three generations there.

Everybody was playing off in something different. You know, the twins are four years old, so theirs was a little bit more on the tactile stuff. They loved the blocks and playing on there. And the stage. There was a [00:26:00] stage there. They were up on that stage having a grand time. And of course we were looking at other stuff as You know, my son and his wife, my wife, it was, it was just so much fun as an experience for the family.

Andrea Durham: And we really intentionally design every space so that three generations can find something to do within the same space. So, A, you don't lose your four year olds, which is always a good thing. 

Jeff Holden: Or, not necessarily. 

Andrea Durham: Because you need, what you don't want is to have a space where just one of those generations is interested and the other people are like Can we go home now?

Jeff Holden: Right. 

Andrea Durham: So, we really try hard, so I'm really glad it worked for your family. 

Jeff Holden: Oh, they drifted off into the coloring table. Wait, there's all this stuff for you to engage with and see, and, and I noticed yesterday the same thing. There were groups of kids going over to the coloring table, and they were scratching out stuff, but some of what they were doing was stuff they had just seen.

Andrea Durham: Exactly. You know, 

Jeff Holden: it was bones, or it was little animals, or whatever it may [00:27:00] be. 

Andrea Durham: That's purposeful. It's all well thought out and designed by our team. 

Jeff Holden: Great job. 

Andrea Durham: Thank you. 

Jeff Holden: Great job. I'm 

Andrea Durham: very proud of everybody. 

Jeff Holden: Question for you with regard to community interaction, collaborators. You have so much to offer to so many different organizations.

Who do you work with a lot in terms of the community besides, let's say, the obvious, the school districts and the schools? 

Andrea Durham: We have a wonderful partnership with UC Davis and UC Davis Health. You know there's So much science that's going on, so much research, so much of all kinds of things going on at UC Davis.

So we love that partnership because we know we can just call them up, we can say, Hey, we would really like to highlight, we'd love to have some science come this weekend, scientists come this weekend and help people understand more about the brain. We have a health exhibition that has a piece on the [00:28:00] brain, but We can't always present the most cutting edge research.

First of all, it would be over most of our heads. And second of all, we can't change the exhibit every week. Some of this research is, is happening at the moment, right? Every week there's more discoveries being made. So it's really helpful to have a live scientist come in and bring some of that to life and share some of the phenomenal research that's happening.

So we do things like that. We have a homeschool day four times a year. We have A long list of partners that we call on, they're themed. And so if the theme, the last theme was the world around us. And so we had all kinds of organizations come in. We had an organization that brought in, brought in maggots and paint.

And they did maggot painting, which was a blast. I have a, I have a maggot painted piece of art in my office that I'm keeping forever. We get people from The visual on 

Jeff Holden: that is really rough. 

Andrea Durham: It's so cool. 

Jeff Holden: Not on the outcome [00:29:00] of it, but just the process of it. 

Andrea Durham: We had a live snake, and they talked about snakes, and helped people learn about snakes.

We have, SAC sewer comes in on weekends, and sometimes talks about water quality, and how we keep, they keep our water safe. We have so many partners that really help us bring science to life. And make it all come alive for people, whether it's on weekends or homeschool days or, or whatever the case may be.

So, UC Davis is one of our biggest partners, but I just mentioned a bunch more. 

Jeff Holden: You did, yeah. We 

Andrea Durham: want more partners. One of my dreams is that when a university is getting ready to apply for a grant, any of the wonderful universities in our area, That one of their first calls will be to us, because all researchers are required to share their research with the public.

It's important. It's public funding. It's important that the public know what discoveries are going to be made through that research. And so they need to have a public communication [00:30:00] opponent. And that can be us. I've done that. Every other city I've, I've worked in, in the other science museums I've been at.

And if they call us, then we can say, Hey, we can, you can focus on your research. We can help you communicate it to the public. We can put it in the public's vernacular in a way they can understand. And we can bring your research to life with you at the museum. And it's such a win win. It's a beautiful partnership and it's a great source of funding for us.

And. You know, it's a total classic win win. Right. And so my dream is that they all know we're here, and we're all ready to do that public communication with you. 

Jeff Holden: And you're doing a great job of voicing it right here, too, which is important. 

Andrea Durham: I'm trying. 

Jeff Holden: Not to mention, then the public gets engaged with it, whereas If not, if they don't get to see it and understand it and experience it, they really don't know why it's good.

Andrea Durham: Right. Sometimes they can be scared. Lack of knowledge sometimes [00:31:00] creates fear. So it's really good. There was a, years ago, it was okay for people to just do research in basements and nobody really knew or understood. That, that just doesn't really happen anymore. 

Jeff Holden: Right. I love the concept of that full circle 360 integration from research to experience and public comment.

And you get feedback that way too. You get a better understanding of Well, maybe I was off a little bit on that concept there. The community is not as involved or maybe even concerned as we think they should be. 

Andrea Durham: Right. So how 

Jeff Holden: do we manage that out? Because in some cases we need them to be involved. 

Andrea Durham: Almost every scientist that comes is blown away by the questions they get and it helps them be better researchers.

I can imagine. Right? Sometimes they'll say, I never thought of that question, but that actually might. It's, it makes me think a little differently about [00:32:00] this research I'm doing or, or make me want to go back to the lab and explore some more. It's really, it's very rewarding for everybody. 

Jeff Holden: On the point you mentioned in that conversation we just had was something about where there's grant opportunities for the museum, which is a perfect segue to funding.

How is the museum funded? 

Andrea Durham: So our budget is about six million dollars, and roughly half of that comes from admissions. We have fairly affordable admission costs. Then there's what we call ancillary, things like parking in our gift shop, and The other half. Yep. Yes. Rental events. We are open for business. If you, we were talking before we started recording about how you've been to some parties.

Jeff Holden: Yes. 

Andrea Durham: At the museum. And it's great because you can have a party. It's So much better a party. I'm sorry, Hilton, but the [00:33:00] Hilton Ballroom is not Mosaic, right? So, it's so much more fun to have a party, especially if you're a science affiliated organization, to have a party at Mosaic because people can play with the exhibits while they're talking and having a beverage.

Anyway, so that's my plug for having your party at Mosaic. 

Jeff Holden: As one of the revenue streams. 

Andrea Durham: Exactly. So that, that comprises, so we call that earned revenue, and that's about half of our revenue, and the other half is philanthropic, it's grants, philanthropy from wonderful, our wonderful donors and supporters, corporations.

The City and SMUD, of course, are huge supporters, as I mentioned before, UC Davis, they named our multiverse, we have the UC Davis Multiverse Theater, thanks to their giving. So the other half comes from philanthropy. 

Jeff Holden: How many people travel through those doors in the course of a year? 

Andrea Durham: [00:34:00] Last year we had 180, 000 people.

25, 000 of those were school groups, which we love. 

Jeff Holden: Wow. Yeah. Wow. 

Andrea Durham: Yeah. 

Jeff Holden: And was that easy to accommodate? 

Andrea Durham: Yes. Well, I'll qualify that. There are days when we are bursting at the seams. 

Jeff Holden: Okay. 

Andrea Durham: And there are days when you could have a very solitary experience. And so, it really follows, if you think about your everyday life, you probably wouldn't bring your three generations on a Tuesday at two o'clock.

Right? So, We hit peaks and valleys with school vacation weeks and when people are off work and want to spend that quality time together. Weather unfortunately, it's weather related too. I 

Jeff Holden: can imagine that. Yeah. And it 

Andrea Durham: does not rain enough in California for my liking. So 

Jeff Holden: now you're learning, right? You're coming from Massachusetts.

You've got a big bay and [00:35:00] a lot of water right there. You're on the opposite end of it. 

Andrea Durham: So. If you want to, if you, if you are crowd averse, hot tip, don't come on a rainy day. 

Jeff Holden: Oh, sure. There's your tip 

Andrea Durham: of the day. 

Jeff Holden: 180, 000, would 250 be realistic in the course of a year? 

Andrea Durham: Oh, absolutely. Okay. Yeah, we're here to serve everybody.

We would like to serve more people. I kind of joke that if I have a, if I had a dollar for every time somebody told me, oh yeah, I've driven by on I 5 and I've wondered about that building or I've been meaning to go, that would, those dollars would add up to solving our philanthropic goals. Based on the 

Jeff Holden: amount of traffic you got.

What a wonderful visual it is. And it's so vivid. It's just a 

Andrea Durham: beautiful, beautiful state of the art building. It 

Jeff Holden: is. And The lettering, I'll call it the logo, 

Andrea Durham: a little bit 

Jeff Holden: different on the building, just stands out and pops so well. That's the best billboard you could [00:36:00] ever have. 

Andrea Durham: Well you'd think, but there are a lot of people who still don't know we're here.

So for giving me the opportunity to talk about it. We're doing more marketing. We're being more current on social media. We're doing a lot of things. But yes, you're right. We could accommodate a lot more people. We'd love to welcome a lot more people. Ride your bike there. Take public, we don't have fabulous public transportation, but we're working on that.

And sometimes our parking lot gets full. So again, if you come, come early. Come later in the day. 

Jeff Holden: And if I'm not mistaken The bike trail runs very, very close. 

Andrea Durham: So close that I ride my bike to work every day. 

Jeff Holden: There we go. 

Andrea Durham: Yeah, it's, it's a beautiful bike trail that goes right along the river. And it's not used, being a bike, being somebody who bikes to work, I don't see as many people on that bike path as I wish I did.

But it goes right from Old Sack. People, people walk from Old [00:37:00] Sack all the time. It's half a mile from the History Museum. to come to Mossack, so you can walk from Old Sack when you're doing a day out, or you can ride your bike, which is a beautiful trail, as I said, along the river. So, there are many ways to get there, and we'd love to have everybody.

Jeff Holden: How many people do you employ? 

Andrea Durham: About 52 right now. 

Jeff Holden: Okay. 

Andrea Durham: About half of those are part time. We rely heavily on terrific part time people who might be college students that are picking up some extra money or things like that. People with different schedules. So we have about half full time and about half part time.

Part time to help welcome school groups. We have higher visitation on weekends sometimes. So we have a lot of weekend workers, things like that. 

Jeff Holden: Volunteer docents as well. 

Andrea Durham: Yes. We have terrific, terrific volunteers that help with all kinds of things. They help with our visitor, helping our visitors in their [00:38:00] curiosity journey, but they also help in on events.

They welcome people to laser shows. Oh yeah, I have to put in a plug for laser shows. I 

Jeff Holden: was going to ask you about that. I saw it on the website and I was really intrigued by it. 

Andrea Durham: They're really fun. People have a great experience because we have a 25, 000 watt sound system. So that means there is a subwoofer the size of your refrigerator.

We love to talk about that. And so you get to, it's like you're at a concert. You get the feeling of being at a live concert, but of course it's not. And you, but you get to experience these fun, creative laser patterns on, on the dome. And each one is different for the artist. Billy Eilish has different graphics than Taylor Swift, than ACDC.

We got something for everybody. We even have a movie magic show at four o'clock on weekends that's very family friendly. It's songs like from Lion King or Frozen, things like that. And [00:39:00] so the laser shows You can see on our website, we have many, many artists, and people are really, really enjoying those.

Jeff Holden: That sounds like a lot of fun. And it's done in that closed environment, again, of serenity, meaning it's really quiet, so it's probably great acoustics that 

Andrea Durham: you're 

Jeff Holden: getting in that dome there. 

Andrea Durham: Very experiential. 

Jeff Holden: Let's take a quick break from the science discussion with Andrea to hear from the people who make this program possible.

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To learn more about RSE, visit rs e. com. 

Scott Thomas: Hello, this is Scott Thomas with CAP Trust in our Sacramento office. I specialize in working with local nonprofits and associations. Annually, we survey private and public nonprofit organizations across the country to better understand challenges they see in today's environment.

In our more recent survey, we heard concerns about proper board governance, mission aligned investment, and how to implement all term investments. If you would like a copy of the survey or to discuss your organization, look me up, scottthomasatcaptrust. com. 

Jeff Holden: I'm thrilled to have Western Health Advantage partnering with us as they do so much to support so many non profit agencies in our community.

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com. So let's take a little bit of a deviation. Money, no object. Any non profit. Money always is an object in some way, shape, or form, but if it wasn't, what would the museum look like? And you have a bit of a benefit because yours is a newer facility, and so you're not facility deprived, you know, with, with deferred maintenance.

Yeah, you're in it every day, so you know what it requires, but if it wasn't, what would it look like? What would you do differently? 

Andrea Durham: So, of course, I dream. People in museums are dreamers, too, right? That's how it came to 

Jeff Holden: be. 

Andrea Durham: Yeah, I dream about it all the time. Several [00:42:00] things. The first thing would probably be an infinite scholarship fund.

You're saying money's no object, so I would say a giant scholarship fund that helps support every school's ability to come, right? We need to, we have to charge admission to schools. There's the cost of school buses. There are challenges that not every school district can meet. And so I would love to have a giant scholarship fund that we could help every teacher who wants to bring their class from there.

Part two of that is that even if we had a giant scholarship fund, not every school could come for many reasons. Maybe we are too, maybe we're, they're even further than Chico. And there are limits to how long kids will sit on a bus. So I'd love to form a team. We're talking to you, 

Jeff Holden: Red Bluff. 

Andrea Durham: I'd love to have a fleet of vans and a big team of people that could go out to schools and do fabulous science demonstrations in their auditorium or their gymnasium or do labs [00:43:00] in their classrooms and have us bring the science to them.

Of course we want everybody to come to MOSAC. A 

Jeff Holden: little mini mobile 

Andrea Durham: MOSAC. Right. Mobile MOSAC. Hey, we've, there we go. We already have a name for it. Thanks. So love would love to see that happen. Because of course, we want everybody to come to mosaic because it's it's all the things we've been describing.

But we can also bring science to the community of if to schools if money was no object. And then when you since you brought up the facility, There's a lot more fun science out there than we can stuff into that building, and we don't, frankly, we don't have enough parking for the really busy days or the huge events that our capacity can hold.

So I would blow up our parking lot, and I would build a big honkin parking garage. 

Jeff Holden: And stack it? 

Andrea Durham: Yeah. And, on top of it, we could have more space for more exhibits, we could have more labs. Right now we have two labs, which accommodates a lot of students, but there's more demand for [00:44:00] that. And so we could serve our community even more by making it easier for them to, to park and to have more science experiences.

And so that's what I would do. 

Jeff Holden: Well, you know, just the thought of your parking structure alone. For your facility, yes, but for all the activities that are anticipated coming into town, to have a double stack or a triple stack parking facility there would take a lot of pressure off of Where we run out of parking space.

Well, 

Andrea Durham: and it's a, it's a, we're in a hip and happening 

Jeff Holden: Yes. 

Andrea Durham: Part of town, right? Yes. The beautiful, beautiful Hanami Line Park opened last summer, right next to us. I would encourage everybody to come in the spring when those cherry trees are in bloom. 

Jeff Holden: Sacramento Tree Foundation, correct? 

Andrea Durham: Correct. Our friends there helped, and the city, and a lot of wonderful donors helped make that happen.

And they are literally our next door neighbor. So you can park at MoSAC and go to the park. Of course, we want people to bike because we are trying to save [00:45:00] this planet. And so when anybody can come and enjoy that park, the hope is that people will bike there, but you're welcome to park. So that's, so MoSAC was kind of the first new, newbie in our neighborhood and then the Hanami Line Park was the next thing in our neighborhood and of course so much is going to happen over in the rail yards and that area is not going to look anything like this 10 years from now.

Jeff Holden: Totally agreed. And so we're at the, we're at the forefront of it all. 

Andrea Durham: Yeah. Yeah. And so, yeah, we, we, I think this vital area needs more resources. I hope, 

Jeff Holden: I hope somebody with a lot of money, some huge philanthropist is sitting here hearing this. Who's engaged in STEM and that's their cause and where they want to leave their legacy because you're ready to accept it.

Andrea Durham: I sure am. I love, I love talking about MOSAC. I love listening to donors and hearing their passion and finding those connections. That's my [00:46:00] favorite thing about my job. Actually, is making those connections, figuring out how we can work together to make the world a better place through the generosity of people who, as you said, are really passionate about making a difference in the world.

The kids and humans, the humans of all ages that come to MOSAC are the people that are going to solve the wicked challenges of the world. They're our future. When adults come and get more interested in science and make it feel more accessible, they're going to make better decisions at the voting booths.

that are going to make a difference in our world. So we're really here for all. It's never too late to learn and get involved in science. And so there are a lot of donors that are really passionate about lots of these, these aspects of STEM. And I love talking with them about the intersection of their passion and how we help serve them.

Jeff Holden: Back to the reality of the facility for sure, because I'm certain it's not an easy maintenance prospect with all [00:47:00] that you've got going on. What is the greatest need? Greatest 

Andrea Durham: need is really supporting our ability to serve the public. I think there are funders who think only new shiny things are what they want to donate to, but, you know, we are a new shiny thing, and all of us who are providing shiny things already, you know, sometimes you don't need new, new, new shiny things, you know, we need to go.

Pay the staff a good wage. So, you know, if we talk about in the nonprofit world, like there's no reason why people should have to take a pledge of poverty to make the world a better place. 

Jeff Holden: Correct. 

Andrea Durham: Right. So paying those indirect costs is a real thing. And that money doesn't just fall from the heavens. And so so really supporting the core mission.

And the, the things that makes our beautiful cultural [00:48:00] institutions run and make us able to do the wonderful things that serve the public, that's really the greatest need. And maybe people don't think that's exciting enough, but really we don't always need a new thing. We need to do what we're doing really, really well and with the resources to do it at the excellent level that our community deserves.

Jeff Holden: Well, with the Laser exhibits for shows, that's new and novel and that's shiny and your technology exhibits that change. 

Andrea Durham: They do. Those 

Jeff Holden: are the new and shiny parts, they keep coming. And we are not going to slow or stop the technological movement in so many ways, whether it is in a biological sense or in a water sense or electrical or whatever it may be, engineering.

Speaking of, just an aside that I was What I'm really intrigued by is when the original facility was being dismantled, [00:49:00] there was a 

Andrea Durham: smokestack, 

Jeff Holden: and one of the staff was telling me there's a piece of that smokestack in the ceiling, hanging in the ceiling. 

Andrea Durham: Yeah, there were four smokestacks actually. Oh my goodness.

There were four of those. That really are just kind of evocative of those smokestacks at this point, but yeah. 

Jeff Holden: So cool that somebody had the foresight to say, let's not get rid of it. Keep a piece of it for posterity in the building. And they're not visible really, unless somebody points them out. 

Andrea Durham: It's a little insider thing.

It 

Jeff Holden: is. It wasn't it. We're sharing a secret. 

Andrea Durham: Yeah, that's 

Jeff Holden: fine. 

Andrea Durham: That's 

Jeff Holden: fine. And it was so cool to think, 

Andrea Durham: yeah, 

Jeff Holden: that is. Yeah. Really neat that they did that. 

Andrea Durham: There was so much work that went into restoring that beautiful historic building. And I'm, I'm a hobby historic preservationist. So I really respect that.

And it's, I think our community had a lot of love for that building. So it's really wonderful that it kind of is like full circle. I think that building was built in 1912 and it was abandoned for more than a hundred years of [00:50:00] its existence. And so it's wonderful that we could do our part to help. It was the first, it was the PG and E building was the first electricity that came to Sacramento.

So it's a little full circle to think that was some of the early STEM in Sacramento, and now it's a STEM institution. But I want to go back to what you said about things changing all the time because I think that's one of the misconceptions about museums. There are a lot of misconceptions that are like, oh, museum, I wouldn't know what to do in a museum.

It's not for me. What is it? So I love that you were talking about how hands on it is and how, yes, things change all the time. And we have, that's, and those things don't Just fall in our laps. That's our fabulous staff that they're inventing those new activities They're inventing new programs new exhibits.

We change out our exhibits all the time and The exhibits themselves change just because they're so open ended So we have we have people who come weekly 

Jeff Holden: Those are really we [00:51:00] do those are fans. 

Andrea Durham: Yes. We have members that if you look in their record, they came 150 times last year 

Jeff Holden: Good for them. Those are people I want to hang around in my neighborhood, say, tell me about, because they're going to know.

Yeah. They've, they've been through that museum. They've experienced so much of it. Right. With its changing dynamic and, and exhibits to say, oh no, no, if you do this, this or that happens. How do you know all this? Well, it's because I can go to Mosaic 

Andrea Durham: every 

Jeff Holden: other day. 

Andrea Durham: Yeah. I also want to mention that we have an amazing program called Museums for All.

And it's a national program. You can look up any museum and see if they're a part of the museums for all network. What it does is it helps us all to serve the public for whom our admission price might be a barrier. So if you are the owner of a snap EBT card, you can walk into MoSAC with three family members and we will welcome you for free.[00:52:00] 

Completely for free. We started that program soon after I got to MOSAC last year. And in the year and a half, we've been welcoming people through that program. We've welcomed over 10, 000 people for absolutely free. 

Jeff Holden: Who may not have experienced. The museum, if it wasn't free, because they don't have the means to do so.

Andrea Durham: And since you were talking about donors and philanthropy, I will mention that support for that program. I'd love to talk to anybody who wants to have their name on that program as a proud sponsor to help that segment of our community that really, the benefits of kids being exposed to This type of open ended STEM and STEM learning early is almost indescribable.

Jeff Holden: Well, and clearly the need is there with 10, 000 coming through. Exactly. 

Andrea Durham: And I would love for it to be proud sponsor, you know, Museums for All presented by a very proud sponsor who cares deeply about our community. 

Jeff Holden: [00:53:00] What is the best way to learn about everything that's going on? There's so much and directions because yeah, like you said so many of us drive by it.

How do you get to it? It's down there. Yeah, it's 

Andrea Durham: Just And when you're going north on I 5, you just pop right off where it says Jeboom Street or Richards. 

Jeff Holden: Richards. 

Andrea Durham: Richards, thank you. Yep, Richards. The Richards exit going north or south. And we're on Jeboom Street. It's kind of right around the corner from that exit.

So do that. We also, you can learn about all the things that are happening at visitmosaic. org. We've got, we're on all the social media channels. So there are a lot of ways to learn. Sign up for our newsletter. It helps, it helps you see like all the wonderful things that are happening when we have special programming.

We put it on our monthly newsletter. So, yeah. And 

Jeff Holden: I will put the link to the website in the show notes for anybody that's listening. You can go right on your phone if you're listening on your app and just. Push it and [00:54:00] find out everything that's going on at the museum. Now! Perfect. Whenever you choose.

Andrea, what an enlightening experience and what a neat facility, what a neat thing for Sacramento that you and your team are doing with Mozak and SMUD, one of your biggest supporters I'm sure. Their name is attached to it. 

Andrea Durham: It is the SMUD Museum of Science and Curiosity and we're so grateful for their support.

They care, of course, we all know they're such a huge community supporter and they are at the leading edge of helping to save this planet. So our missions are in total alignment. And 

Jeff Holden: I was going to say they do so much and they're so far advanced in their sustainability for producing. The energy that we need 

Andrea Durham: very proud to have them here.

We're very fortunate that our community was able to put together resources and make mosaic happen. It's really a lot. We're loved by the community and we hope everybody comes 

Jeff Holden: [00:55:00] and unlike so many Perceptions that people have of museums was old stuff for me to see but I mean, and it doesn't change its old why nothing new comes in there to the contrary.

That's not what mosaic is. Mosaic is the today forward museum. It's it's not looking at the historical pieces static. It's taking that history. And moving it forward and showing us 

Andrea Durham: what it all means. But, you know, I want to say that I love this industry. I've been in the museum industry for a very long time.

And there really isn't I'd be hard pressed to think of a museum on Earth that is the old stagnant. That is from yes, that is the museum of yesterday. 

Jeff Holden: And we need to say that. Tell us. Yeah. All museums 

Andrea Durham: are. I'll put in a plug for me. So we have 32 museums in Sacramento. Did you know that? 

Jeff Holden: No, I did not. 

Andrea Durham: And they're all great.

We're really pretty tight. Museum people are [00:56:00] tight with each other. We love each other. It's a great, great field to be in. I feel privileged because we support each other so much. Our Sacramento History Museum is amazing. Fun fact. That is amazing. They have more social media followers than any museum on planet earth.

So they're fabulous friends of ours. There's no museum that is stagnant anymore. It's not that kind of world anymore. You don't survive as a museum if you're stagnant. And so. Yeah, come to museums. They're fun. There's a, I think there is a misperception that they're dusty and something, or people are afraid.

They're fun. They're, you know, you get to take things into your own hands, and it's, I'm a big fan of museums, so I'm super biased, but I'm proud of being biased, so visit your local museums. All of them. And that's what 

Jeff Holden: I love about this conversation. Your energy, your excitement about it, your passion, as you talk about some of the exhibits and the people and the donors.

Makes Sacramento proud. 

Andrea Durham: Aw, thank you. [00:57:00] Thank you. I've been, this is the friendliest city I've lived in. And I love it here. I'm so glad I came here and came to Mosaic. 

Jeff Holden: Well, we're glad you're here. 

Andrea Durham: Thank you. And thank 

Jeff Holden: you for the conversation today. 

Andrea Durham: Thank you so much, Jeff.

Jeff Holden: Thank you for listening to the Nonprofit Podcast Network. I hope you enjoyed the episode. If what you heard moved you, please reach out to that organization and do what you can to help. If you like and appreciate what we're doing to support local nonprofits, please give us a positive review, subscribe, and share.

If you're a nonprofit with an interest in participating in an episode, you can reach me at jeff at hearmenowstudio. com. If you have a need for the services or products our sponsors offer, please reach out to them. CapTrust, fiduciary advice for endowments and foundations. Runyon Saltzman Incorporated, RSC, marketing, advertising, and public relations creating integrated [00:58:00] communications committed to improving lives.

And Western Health Advantage, a full service health care plan for individuals, employer groups, and families. The Nonprofit Podcast Network is a production of, is recorded at, and edited by Hear Me Now Studio.